xjwsforChrist

I'm wondering how Peter knew that. Was it:
1) Someone else knew what they did because they heard or saw the transaction and told Peter; or
2) Peter or another brother came upon the knowledge by a gift of the holy spirit; if so, which one or ones?
3) Other



Now this is the only part of the account that went against my grain a little bit. Peter has just had a hand in effecting a man's death. The dead man's wife comes in three hours later and Peter is still so enraged that he doesn't inform her that her husband died (never mind that she didn't even get to attend the burial), but he proceeds to do the same thing to her, knowing what the likely outcome will be.

I (think I) understand that his anger was not so much personal, but was outraged that someone would try to do that to God himself and I know he was very zealous. But it seemed it could have been handled a different way if he had wanted to show mercy. Maybe she could have been told her husband had died and then proceeded to tell her the reason and let it work on her a while to see if she would repent and confess or maybe she still would have expired. Not sure I trust Peter with that key.

Also I'm thinking that weren't they part of the ones that were filled with holy spirit - does that mean they were anointed and sealed? Are they condemned to death, since Peter bound them?

This topic is way deeper than it appears on the surface; thank you for this Shelby, a reminder to really check ourselves out before it is too late.

Some really good thoughts/questions, dear Ataloa (mornin' and peace to you, dear lady!)... and I am permitted to respond



It was revealed to him by Christ, dear one, THROUGH holy spirit. What some don't understand, especially those who wee taught erroneously by the WTBTS... is that that is one of the... mmmmmm... "benefits"... of the union with Christ: what HE knows... WE (can) know! Through it, that blood that SPEAKS... we can have "the mind of Christ." Hence, HIS thoughts can be OUR thoughts... through that BLOOD union that we have! That is how I, your servant, know/understand the things I share with you all. Yes, most often I hear his VOICE, but there are times when I hear/feel his THOUGHTS. Sometimes BEFORE he actually speaks. And certainly, he mine - he already KNOWS what I'm thinking... so no point in trying to answer otherwise; I cannot fool him because he already KNOWS. And so that's how, some times, I can share with you what, say, Paul or John or even Peter... THOUGHT... and so MEANT (at the time): because we ARE... ALL... one! Our thoughts are often the SAME!

If folks could only grasp this truth, grasp ALL that the blood DOES in its "speaking"!

Maybe this will help some to understand what I mean, though: I am SURE there are times when, as a wife/husband, because you know your dear spouse SO well, you virtually KNOW what s/he's thinking in certain situations, indeed, most situations for some... yes? You have a UNION... by means of FLESH... that allows you to be able to do that. The union with CHRIST... by SPIRIT... the blood we SHARE... HOLY spirit... allows the SAME thing... but even MORE. And unlike the union of flesh, that ends such shared thoughts when one spouse dies... the union with Christ does not do that: we can know what he means NOW... as well as what he meant "in the Ark/Beginning"... as well as what others of us mean/meant/thought/said, etc. True, some claim to still "feel" and hear their deceased spouse. Which could be TRUE, but not how THEY think, if the union what THAT great (more often than not, it wasn't). What such ones are "feeling" and "hearing"... is themselves... because that deceased spouse WOULD have been in agreement/union WITH their thoughts/desires/etc., were they still HERE. The union was SO strong that even when one spouse is sleeping (in death), the surviving spouse thinks they are still feeling/hearing their presence/words/thoughts. It is the same with some twins... as well as siblings/children with whom one was very close.

Now, imagine, that one has a union with CHRIST... who is NOT dead. NEVER dies. Does not SLEEP (in death). In THIS case, it is an ACTIVE union... STILL. ALWAYS. For eternity.

And so it was the same thing here: our dear Lord told Peter DIRECTLY... through the holy spirit... blood... he put IN Peter. Through it, he "spoke: and told Peter what they had done.



Yes. And there are two things to consider here: Peter's perhaps hasty and rash reaction, which very well may have caused their death through HIS "binding" judgment... if that is what occurred (and my understanding is that it did, which is ANOTHER reason not to follow Peter - in imitating him, as well as Paul, some have left off MERCY in their "righteous indignation")... but that he DID give BOTH the opportunity to come CLEAN and speak the TRUTH! Especially since they were claiming to be who they were claiming to be: members of the Body of Christ.



Yep! So, again, following Peter... not such a good idea. Following Christ... ALWAYS the BEST idea!



Well, no, I can see why he DIDN'T tell her: her response would not have been HONEST. It would have been COMPELLED, out of FEAR ("Oh, shoot! He died?! Well, I BETTER tell the truth, NOW!"). But that wouldn't have been HER truth! We're supposed to WANT to speak the truth... and we WILL... IF THE TRUTH IS TRULY IN US. If it/he is NOT... we can't try to fool holy spirit and act/pretend like it is. What is done in the "dark" (lies/falsehood, etc.)... WILL be brought to the light (truth)!



Ahh, but dear At... that is why it was given to HIM: our dear Lord KNEW what these two would eventually try. As he knew what Judas Iscariot was going to eventually do (betray him)... Peter was going to do (deny him). He KNEW they were going to try and lie to him. Had he given it to the others, perhaps they WOULD have been shown mercy. But remember... blasphemy reaps a more serious end. So, here, dear Peter was merely a "tool." A willing one, unfortunately, as he COULD have pleaded for mercy for them... which would have shown that HE had (finally) got it. But he didn't do anything "wrong," per se... as he HAD been given the authority to "bind" folks. So...



WONDERFUL question! Anointed, yes! They were of those who received holy spirit at Pentecost. This Ananias is the same one to whom Saul of Tarsus was sent! I know, I know... many teach that he was a different man, that our Lord would not have sent Saul to such a man. They are in error. He was the same one.

BUT... no, they weren't sealed. It is only those of the 144,000 chosen from among the sons of Israel who are sealed. Those who are of the nations must "make the calling AND CHOOSING of [themselves] SURE." Once sealed, those of the 144,000 cannot lose their place; that's why they are SEALED. The of the nations, however, CAN be "grafted back OUT"... just as they were "grafted" IN (to the Tree [of Life]). This is what Paul wrote about to the NON-Israelite chosen ones in Rome:

"I am talking to you Gentiles. Inasmuch as I am the apostle to the Gentiles, I take pride in my ministry in the hope that I may somehow arouse my own people to envy and save some of them. For if their rejection brought reconciliation to the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead? If the part of the dough offered as firstfruits is holy, then the whole batch is holy; if the root is holy, so are the branches.

"If some of the branches have been broken off, and you, though a wild olive shoot, have been grafted in among the others and now share in the nourishing sap from the olive root, do not consider yourself to be superior to those other branches. If you do, consider this: You do not support the root, but the root supports you. You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I could be grafted in.” Granted. But they were broken off because of unbelief, and you stand by faith. Do not be arrogant, but tremble. For if God did not spare the natural branches, he will not spare you either.

"Consider therefore the kindness and sternness of God: sternness to those who fell, but kindness to you, provided that you continue in his kindness. Otherwise, you also will be cut off. And [u]if they do not persist in unbelief, they will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again[/u]. After all, if you were cut out of an olive tree that is wild by nature, and contrary to nature were grafted into a cultivated olive tree, how much more readily will these, the natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree!" Romans 11:13-24



JAH is merciful, dear sister. Who knows what HIS judgment for these two will ultimately be? Yes, our dear Lord said, as to Peter and the others, that whatever they bound on earth was bound in the spirit realm... but... HE DIDN'T SAY FOR HOW LONG. Yes?



It is... and I thank YOU for giving opportunity to bring (some more) things to light!



You are quite welcome, dear one... and yes: none of what to "wake up" and find out we were actually a FOOLISH virgin, right? The time to STOP fooling OURSELVES... let alone others... then, is NOW. While we are alive in the flesh. And there is a way to do that: by learning to speak the PURE language of Christ: with him, with JAH, with others... and certainly with ourselves. I will share in a separate post just what that "language" is.

But as always, peace to YOU, dear Ataloa!

YSSFS of Christ,

Shellamar

I have to correct something, dear At (again peace to you!). While Ananias/Sapphira were present at the outpouring of holy spirit on Pentecost, and so were of Israel, NOT Gentiles, they had not yet received a sealing (the two are not necessarily simultaneous). I have just heard that that is WHY what occurred was allowed: them being sealed would have been like allowing Adham/Eve back IN... to eat from the Tree of Life... and LIVE... forever. Peter's actions were tantamount to the "flaming sword" - it constituted a "cutting off" FROM that Tree... Christ... the Life. As "branches"... they were "lopped off."

Does that mean for eternity? All I hear is that it is not my concern and JAH shows mercy to whomever He wishes. So... I don't know, dear one, and am not going to ask about or ponder over it. I'm sure you understand.

Again, peace to you!

YSSFS of Christ,

Shellamar

Just to clarify Shelby, won't the sealing of ALL be done before the 'releasing of the four winds' ?

Loz x

_________________
"This is my son. LISTEN to Him!"

Only the 144 000 are sealed, yes?


Peace,
tammy

Good question Tammy.

Loz x

_________________
"This is my son. LISTEN to Him!"

All of those who ARE sealed are before the four winds are unleashed, yes, dear Loz (peace to you!), and as dear Tams shared (peace, love!), are those from among the sons of Israel (so that the promise to Abraham is sure). So when/how are the others sealed?

John told us:

"These are the ones who come OUT of the great tribulation..."

The first group is sealed BEFORE the four winds are released. It is the full sealing of this group that allows that event. That event, the release of the winds is what starts that tribulation. In order for those who come OUT of it to DO so... they must be sealed. So, while the first group is sealed BEFORE, the others receive a sealing... DURING.

So that when Christ returns... which occurs IMMEDIATELY AFTER the tribulation has ENDED... he gathers ALL of them... ALL of his sheep, the little flock AND other sheep... who, together, make up ONE flock.

I hope this helps!

Again, peace to you, both!

YSSFS of Christ,

Shellamar

Lol! I had a little coughing spell on that one. They sure were in a hurry to ditch him out. I'm surprised they didn't cremate him.


You have a point.


As a witness, I was taught that wives didn't have very much accountability if their husbands were believing. I don't remember if that was a general teaching, but I remember hearing it from an elder's wife, that she was only accountable a little bit.

This account kind of proves otherwise, doesn't it? (and I think what your elder's wife believed only comes natural, because in the wts reasoning and rules, a wife must be in submission to her husband, so if she follows him in doing something wrong/believing something wrong, how can it be her fault? Except with regard to an unbelieving mate and 'spiritual endangerment')

Not bearing responsibility is the reason that some/many people give themselves over to a religion to begin with, and I am SURE that some women prefer to put all that responsibility on their husbands shoulders. So that they can just do as they're told, and when the time comes to give an account, it is the religion/religious leaders/husband's fault and not their own. But we know that is not true. The people who followed the pharisees and religious leaders of Israel were still accountable for their own deeds/words. Blind man follows a blind man, both fall into the pit.


Peace,
tammy

Exactly, dear Tams (mornin' and peace to you... and to you, too, dear At!). Folks forget: we ALL have an accounting. True, we can (perhaps) account for our children and UNbelieving mates, but all BELIEVERS will have to account for themselves... for the (lack of) faith they claim to have ("Lord, Lord, didn't we do such and so... in YOUR name?!").

It is religion's JOB to mislead mankind. EVEN the chosen ones, if possible. And so, the WTBTS' teaching as to wives... well, yes, just another falsehood. And it's because they didn't understand Paul's MOTIVE: saving lives. Women weren't ALLOWED to speak publicly, etc., and so HAD to learn at home, from their husbands who WERE allowed to go to the synagogues, PUBLIC places were the Jewish MEN engaged in discussion of the scriptures, indeed, real ALOUD (as our dear Lord did, remember?).

This is one of the reasons that our dear Lord's vessel was more "male" than "female" - he would have NEVER been able to do what he did as a woman, OMG! BUT... HE had no problem with women, at all, even when his disciples did! He taught, healed, forgave... men AND women... and it was to WOMEN that he first showed himself after rising from the dead.

Women could not have been apostles: the tendency to choose children/husbands OVER JAH/Christ... to the detriment of others in the Body... was too great... and the Jews would have put such women to death anyway. So long as the women stayed in the background... even bore children... they were (relatively) safe. As was the rest of the Body, at least in relation to that.

Women were subject to and submissive to husbands only after the return from exile in Babylon. Before that, women had status, even respect, among Israel. Think Deborah, a judge. Think of how Sarah, Abigail, Michal, et al., all spoke and dealt with their husbands: honestly, candidly, if not outright disrespectful at times (Michal). Think Jezebel. If being disrespectful was a major crime, then Michal would have been stoned, not just put off. Indeed, it was sometimes the OVER-strength of women that caused the MEN of Israel to call for certificates of divorce... which concession was granted by Moses.

I know every man here remembers the proverb, "Better to dwell on the corner of a roof than with a contentious wife." If wives were to be submissive, who could have HAD a contentious wife? Taking on the customs of the Babylonians, however, the Jews changed the status of women when they returned from exile. Indeed, women were GREATLY lowered in class... with the scribes, etc., even creating new "laws" to oppress them! But Christ did not view them that way!

I posted about this on another site, about how it was dangerous for women of the Body because the Jews would look for ANY reason to deliver up christians to the Romans. Women breaking their laws... well, their TRADITIONS, which they TAUGHT as law... was one excuse for doing that. To the detriment of both the women AND the men.

The WTBTS has only further fomented this tradition... the position of women as being subordinate to men... in their own false teachings and attempts to mislead, if possible, even the chosen ones. But Paul spoke the TRUTH when he said, as to the those in Christ:

"There is NEITHER Jew NOR Greek, male NOR female, slave NOR freeman."

Because ALL are EQUAL in Christ. HE is the only "Head" of that Body. But Paul had to find a way to convince the early Body that it was BEST... for women to stay their butts HOME and learn from their husbands... for the safety of the GROUP. Unfortunately, the "strength" of Israel's women... brought on by the nation's tendency toward hard-headedness... made the tactic he chose necessary.

I hope this helps!

Again, peace to you dear ladies!

YSSFS of Christ,

Shellamar