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 Post subject: Re: Why not touch him?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2016 12:43 pm 
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I have read that gospel before, and I also knew that my Lord afterward forgave and healed those who had been harmed.


Yes, dear Tams (peace to you, dear sister!)... and my apologies to not posting the entire account. Somehow, I thought we had discussed these events once before (in a thread where we discussed our Lord attending school at a young age).

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Whatever His experiences as a child... We just happen to know more about the struggle He underwent as a child while learning - to control the power He had; to choose the right and reject the wrong.


Yes, to this, as well. Again, the one whom religion has set up is NOT the One whom WE know as the HOLY One of Israel and Holy Spirit Anymore than the "God" they've contrived is the MOST HOLY One, JAH of Armies. I have shared many times that we MUST put away ALL that we once believed (based on what religion taught us) and let HIM "build." I realize that it can be difficult, but it must be done. We MUST approach as "young children"... and listen to HIM... which means we CAN'T know ANYTHING, can we, except what HE tells us is true. I realize that not only is this a difficult thing to do but that some will also say (perhaps in their hearts), "But aren't we listening to YOU, Shel?" To that, I VEHEMENTLY say, "NO! Do NOT listen to me! Ask FOR YOURSELVES!" If not as to the actual content at least as to whether what I share is TRUE or not.

Even so, I'm sure we can all understand now, if we did not before, why John could NOT share the "revelation" he received when he first received it. Remember, Paul said that he (John) had seen things that a man shouldn't even speak of. Well, I TOTALLY get THAT - LOLOL! Horses that looked like scorpions with hair like women's and colorful garments... at the least! Scarlet-colored wild beasts! And those aren't even the worse things - LOLOL!

To think that our dear Lord may have (intentionally) killed someone, though... in light of what he has shown us as to how he (and the Father) TRULY are... can be "upsetting," I guess. Well, maybe not upsetting, but I do understand how one might have to take a step back and consider the matter. Again, though, we are being taught the TRUTH... which can be hard to look at, sometimes. Praise JAH, then, that we aren't just hit with stuff but are "prepared." Taught in layers, with "foundations" laid FIRST... then truth built upon that.

I apologize to any that I caused concern - that truly was not my intent. And thank you to those who are assisting by sharing your stalwart faith and gratitude in our dear Lord for SHOWING us the truth... especially as to himself.

Peace to you all!

YSSFS of Christ,

Shel


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 Post subject: Re: Why not touch him?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2016 12:48 pm 
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See, that's what I get for trying to post (in a hurry) at work, dear P (peace to you, dear brother!). After re-reading your post, I see that you had already stated the danger would have been to Mary because our dear Lord was not yet fully formed, physically (or to that effect). What I am curious to know, from you, is why that was? Now, could be you are simply sharing what has already been discussed, but I am not sure/clear on that.

So, I guess I'm asking is whether, in your training/understanding, there was something DIFFERENT... some OTHER reason... than what has been shared here, as to why it would have been dangerous for Mary? Something more than just our Lord wasn't fully formed, yet.

If there is nothing more than what has been shared, absolutely no problems - we're on the same page. I am just wanting to make sure. Not for any reason other than I do not want to misunderstand YOU.

I hope that helps and, as always, the greatest of love and peace to you!

YSSFS of Christ,

Shel


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 Post subject: Re: Why not touch him?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2016 2:02 pm 
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I have read that gospel before, and I also knew that my Lord afterward forgave and healed those who had been harmed.


Yes, dear Tams (peace to you, dear sister!)... and my apologies to not posting the entire account. Somehow, I thought we had discussed these events once before (in a thread where we discussed our Lord attending school at a young age).


Yes, it would have helped greatly to know that little tidbit!

Because even when I got past the fact that He wasn't stoned for killing people, I could not believe my Lord would not feel remorse. The Lord has given me peace about this even before it was mentioned that he healed those who had been harmed.

I DO appreciate having knowledge of these things and I can certainly relate to Christ's experiences as a child. If I had had his power, that would have happened to me too. I KNOW it. In fact, when I get really enraged, which doesn't happen often, I have a look I give to people that is so potent, I believe it really could kill, if sustained long enough. Only two or three have ever seen it directed at them, and they were SCARED. It scares me too! But it is not my desire to ever bring harm to anyone, and I wouldn't be able to live with that. But I understand that these things can happen before we can get it under control.


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 Post subject: Re: Why not touch him?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2016 2:54 pm 
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My apologies for that oversight... or rather, short-sightedness... dear, dear At... and dear Loz... and dear FWs. Truly.

The greatest of love... and the peace of our dear Lord... to you all.

YSSFS of Christ,

Shel


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 Post subject: Re: Why not touch him?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2016 4:46 pm 
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Hi all and peace to each and everyone.
I totally get why we must ignore all that we learned whilst attached to a religion.
If I may, I would like to share an experience I had a while ago.
We had a very dear friend staying with us who had left/kicked out of Bethel and then disfellowshipped, basically, for preaching about Christ.
We were sat talking one night and suddenly I had the most powerful feeling. I physically felt like everything had been ripped out from under me. I felt like I had nothing under my feet. It was so powerful that I fled the room and went upstairs. I got down on my knees and I literally cried out saying, 'I don't know how or what but all I know is, this is far greater than I could ever imagine. That there is far more to having a relationship with the Father and his Son than my brain could cope with'. My foundation, everything I had ever believed in had been ripped away and I felt shocked, traumatised even.
It took quite a while to recover from that experience, one I'm sure, I shall not forget in a hurry.
So Shell, when you say to forget all that we were taught whilst attached to a religion, to allow a new foundation to be built, I for one, get what you mean. I'm truly grateful to you and please believe me when I say our Lord has already assured me that what I read was truth.❤

I'm sure I have many more eye popping, heart stopping things to learn, this isn't the first and I know it's not the last.

May I add that we were still attending meetings, well sort of, but stopped after this experience.

Your fellow slave Mal ❤


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 Post subject: Re: Why not touch him?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2016 6:52 pm 
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left/kicked out of Bethel and then disfellowshipped, basically, for preaching about Christ.


Now, THAT is what blew MY mind, dear Mal (the greatest of love and peace to you, dear sister... and to your entire household!)... and literally scared the bee-jeezus out of me - LOLOL! The things I am learning about JAH, Christ, spirit(ual) things, etc., are, as you intimate, wonderful! Marvelous! What made ME feel as if the foundation had been ripped from under me was when I experienced the same thing as your dear friend: animosity for preaching about CHRIST! Say, WHAT, now? And from "Jehovah's Witnesses"??? Although I knew some would have problems with me partaking (they kinda make that clear, don't they?), I had NO idea they would react as they do to someone wanting to know/speak about Christ... OR holy spirit! They won't even discuss the latter on ANY terms! I am SO grateful, then, that our dear Lord was with me EVERY step of the way... and kept reminding me of what he had told me/us as to how we WOULD be treated for his sake! And praise JAH... here we all are - still standing! LOLOL!

As to the other matter, after speaking with dear hubby I can see how the information shared here might be a bit... mmmmm... overwhelming at first. I am MOST grateful, though, that you dear, dear sisters were not stumbled by our Lord as to his childhood. I think, not just having been children ourselves, but being MOTHERS, we can relate (to how impulsive, impetuous, and hasty a child can be, especially with his/her feelings). Imagine one of our own children at age 5... and someone having angered them or hurt their feelings. We would like to think they would handle it graciously - we certainly would like to think that about our dear Lord. But we know there were times when they did not. Imagine, though, as dear At (peace to you, luv!) pointed out... if all we/they had to do was THINK a result as to someone!! O... M... G. I am SURE there have been some casualties of MY (super-hyper-ultra-sensitive) feelings - LOLOLOL!

As for our dear Lord, his little body couldn't have handled all of that power just out the gate. The problem is the FALSE teaching that he was born PERFECT in the flesh - he was NOT. He had to LEARN obedience, so that he could BECOME perfect... which is why he had to "conquer the WORLD." And one of the things [of the world] that he had to learn was to control his anger ("You must be perfect as your heavenly Father is perfect" - Matthew 5:44-48)... which is a fruit of the FLESH, not the SPIRIT. Galatians 5:16-24

Which is why WE must not judge others... why We must put away anger, etc. Because one day, we will possess that power, too. NOT, though, to do harm with it or to punish/wreak vengeance against those who "wrong" us. NOT to destroy. Rather, that power is the SAME power used to CREATE, when handled correctly... and so to bring forth LIFE.

When the Bride sits down with her husband(ly) owner, Christ, then... she can't have hate or anger in her heart. If she does, she could, in an INSTANT... DESTROY those for whom she CAN... and SHOULD... plead. As our Lord has pled and pleads still for US. That is the PURPOSE of a "priesthood," is it not? And so, that is why our dear Lord, the HOLY One of Israel and Holy Spirit, JAHESHUA, the Chosen One of JAH (MischaJAH)... is going... among US... SUBDUING... US. Teaching US peace. Even while his enemies... and ours... still exist. Psalm 110:2

He is teaching us that peace, just as HE learned it from the Father... so that not only are we worthy to rule with him, when the time comes, but so WE don't harm anyone with OUR "tender" feelings. Why? Because the MOST Holy One of Israel, JAH of Armies has SAID... there will be NO harm nor ANY ruin... in ALL His holy mountain. And so, neither can such come from any of us, those who will be like God... and like Christ.

My heart rejoices that you dear ones are able to grasp these things and quickly. For who knows how much time we have? Maybe many years, yet. Maybe another generation. But maybe... not.

Peace to you ALL... and may the undeserved kindness and mercy of our dear Father, the MOST HOLY One of Israel, JAH of Armies, and the love and peace of His Son, our dear Lord, Master, Teacher, Leader, Shepherd, Savior, and King, the HOLY One of Israel and Holy Spirit, JAHESHUA, the Chosen One of JAH (MischaJAH)... be upon you ALL... and upon your dear households... to time indefinite!

YSSFS of Christ,

Shel


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 Post subject: Re: Why not touch him?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2016 10:11 am 
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Good morning and peace to everyone!

I wanted to apologize to everyone, especially Loz, for my raw emotional outburst. I feel like I might have sullied this great thread. So many times, when I've been upset at a posting, the Lord has stopped me from responding immediately, and led me away to learn something important and soften my heart. SO many times what I posted was pretty far from what I would have done if it had been a chat room and not a discussion board. That did not happen this time and I am sorry if it added to anyone being upset.

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I physically felt like everything had been ripped out from under me. I felt like I had nothing under my feet.


See I think this is cool. Not that you were traumatized though. lol.


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 Post subject: Re: Why not touch him?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2016 2:10 pm 
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I personally see no need for anyone to feel apologetic except perhaps me, dear At (peace to you, dear sister!), for not thinking how the young Master's actions might be received. In truth, I did not hear that I was to take extra care with that, and so I didn't. Also in truth, though, perhaps I should have considered it. I truly am sorry I didn't as my omission COULD have caused someone to stumble (and maybe still did) but I truly thought we'd visited that issue awhile ago and I was simply to remind us of it.

I don't think you sullied the thread at all but opened opportunity for us to discuss what we have been given as part and parcel of each thing, which is what we SHOULD be doing (Malachi 3:16 ), whether we do so in full agreement by all or with need for more clarification and even dissention. Praise JAH, this is not religion whereby we must adhere to creeds and doctrines rather than truth, EVEN if such truth is hard to receive (initially).

In turn, our discussing further might help others who are reading here who did NOT know and perhaps ARE stumbled to regain their steps.

[I have to share with you dear, dear people, that I am actually laughing now, NOT out of derision, but because my Lord's words make my heart leap. For our dear Lord just said to me, "But over WHOM would such have stumbled, child? Would it not have been over ME because of the truth about ME... and is it not written and did I not say some WOULD be so stumbled? Am I not the [Corner]stone that causes stumbling? And are YOU not merely a 'small rock'? How, then, can YOU cause a stumbling?"

I laughed, not because I feel let off the hook but because (1) of the lesson in humility he has granted me here - he IS the larger stone, is he not; and (2) the truth of his words - not just as to him, but me, as my given name literally means "small rock" - LOLOL!]

Ennyone, please do NOT despair or feel you owe an apology, dear At. You only responded as perhaps Peter did when told by our dear Lord that one had to eat his flesh and drink his blood. Given that many left our dear Lord at that point because such words SEEMED anathema, our dear Lord's words showed he'd understood that Peter might want to leave off following him, too. He gave Peter the chance to CHOOSE, though, by asking whether or not that one did wanted. We all know Peter chose wisely because he knew the truth of his options.

And the same is with us. We have been told and will most probably be told still things hard to hear. Kinda been that way from the start, no? And yet, here we are. Standing firm, pushing on, staying focused (our gaze on the Copper Serpent)... and so being led into ALL truth. As we were promised we would be.

We just have to remember... or at least I do... our dear Lord's words that:

ALL I will tell you IS written (albeit, not necessarily in the Bible, regardless of the version) but not all that is WRITTEN (in the Bible, regardless of the version) is what I will tell you."

This truth, as to his childhood, is written although perhaps not inclued in the Bible (or certain Bible versions). The truth as to his LEARNING obedience... from the things he SUFFERED... IS in the Bibles that we read today. But what does that mean, he learned obedience from the things he "suffered"? It does NOT refer to his being literally tortured but to his denying his flesh ITS desires . And we know it means that because WE all must suffer [in the flesh], too - yet WE are not all tortured, literally.

We all must take up our TORTURE pole/stake, though, and FOLLOW him. How do we do that? By "impaling" OUR flesh and so denying it ITS desire... which desire is to bear ITS "fruit". HE was able to do that with MUCH prayer and supplication. Galatians 5:19-21; Hebrews 5:7-9

The BEAUTIFUL of it for US... is that BECAUSE of his (eventual) obedience... he was "perfected" and atoned for his own blood so as to be named High Priest. As such, WE now have, in ADDITION to prayer and supplication to God to help US learned obedience... HIS BLOOD. To atone for US... when, in SPITE of prayer and supplication, we are NOT obedient... and sin.

He, though, in BEING perfected, showed himself BETTER than Adham... who started with NO sin in HIM... OR in the world in which he was brought into. Our dear Lord, however, not only came into a world in which sin REIGNED, but did so in a sinFUL vessel! Yet, he SURPASSED Adham! In SPITE of the world and in SPITE of that vessel.

Which is why WE can have COURAGE: he DID it, EVEN though in a vessel LIKE ours and TESTED like US. So, that even if we CAN'T "conquer" the flesh on our own... and we can't, completely, he already has. FOR... US.

I hope that helps (further, because I know you dear ones are already past whatever obstacles arose here).

May the undeserved kindness and mercy of our God and Father, the MOST HOLY One of Israel, JAH of Armies, and the love and peace of His Son, our dear Lord, the HOLY One of Israel and Holy Spirit, JAHESHUA the Chosen One of JAH (MischaJAH), be upon you and upon your dear households... to time indefinite.

Peace to you all!

YSSFS of Christ,

Shel


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 Post subject: Re: Why not touch him?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2016 2:54 pm 
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Well, since we are giving out apologies, then I must apologize also for waiting until late the next day, to post that our Lord had healed those afflicted. I probably should have posted that right away to help those who did not know this. I do also remember discussing this at some point, Shelby, but I do not recall if that was on the board or off the board. So I don't think there is anything wrong with your memory on that.

In any case, I do not feel owed an apology from either you Ataloa, or you Shelby. In fact, this sums up how I feel about this conversation as well:

Quote:
I don't think you sullied the thread at all but opened opportunity for us to discuss what we have been given as part and parcel of each thing, which is what we SHOULD be doing (Malachi 3:16 ), whether we do so in full agreement by all or with need for more clarification and even dissention. Praise JAH, this is not religion whereby we must adhere to creeds and doctrines rather than truth, EVEN if such truth is hard to receive (initially).





Peace and love to you all,
your sister and servant, and fellow slave of Christ,
tammy


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 Post subject: Re: Why not touch him?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2016 7:08 pm 
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Peace to you all today, hope you are well.

I appreciate all the comments and am finding it so encouraging and faith strengthening to learn so much more about our Lord and his childhood.
It is awesome to hear about his challenges and experiences as a young person. What we have recorded in the bibles are so brief as to his childhood.

Yes, this IS beautiful Shel, peace to you girl. And it is because of his ENTIRE life experiences and His sufferings that he was able to conquer for us.


The BEAUTIFUL of it for US... is that BECAUSE of his (eventual) obedience... he was "perfected" and atoned for his own blood so as to be named High Priest. As such, WE now have, in ADDITION to prayer and supplication to God to help US learned obedience... HIS BLOOD. To atone for US... when, in SPITE of prayer and supplication, we are NOT obedient... and sin.

He, though, in BEING perfected, showed himself BETTER than Adham... who started with NO sin in HIM... OR in the world in which he was brought into. Our dear Lord, however, not only came into a world in which sin REIGNED, but did so in a sinFUL vessel! Yet, he SURPASSED Adham! In SPITE of the world and in SPITE of that vessel.

Which is why WE can have COURAGE: he DID it, EVEN though in a vessel LIKE ours and TESTED like US. So, that even if we CAN'T "conquer" the flesh on our own... and we can't, completely, he already has. FOR... US.


Love, your sister and fellow servant of Christ, Kim


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 Post subject: Re: Why not touch him?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2016 8:38 am 
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Good Morning and peace to all of you.

Thank you Shel for sharing the information about our Lord as a child. It really helps me appreciate even more that he understands and can relate to how we feel at times. When he made some bad decisions, he was later able to correct them. Sometimes I have spent too much time regretting decisions made, words spoken, and actions I have taken.
I know this is short but have to go to work. I should have said this days ago but did not. So, I wanted to at least get it out here.

Thanks to all of you.

Finalcall


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 Post subject: Re: Why not touch him?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2016 2:11 pm 
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Sometimes I have spent too much time regretting decisions made, words spoken, and actions I have taken.


We all have such regrets at times, dear FC (peace to you!). And it can be pretty easy to "waste" time on such, especially if we are making things "about" ourselves. No one WANTS to feel bad (about himself/herself), but we all do, at times (unless we are unspeakably arrogant and so never feel even a twinge of regret - and there are such people, make no mistake).

WE, however, who are of the Body of Christ, can know that doing that... concentrating on our errors SO much... can drive us to the point of feeling sorry for ourselves or, worse, being angry with JAH/Christ. Even turning our backs on them. Of what benefit is any of that, though? We don't feel any better. We certainly don't DO any better. Rather, we can become like Adham... and blame others, including JAH. Or like Cain, where we become SO angry because we don't measure up as perhaps another does... and actually kill the other. Or like King Saul, who became so jealous that he sought to kill an anointed of JAH. Or what of Jonah, who said he would go, but didn't, then didn't want to go, but was made to, then became angry because what he THROUGH would/should happen to the people of Nineveh didn't... and so had greater love for a gourd tree than for the people of that city? What benefit to these? None. Nor to the people close to them.

We can be like these... and others who are similar... OR... we can take into consideration what Lazarus wrote in his letter to the Hebrews, which letter contains quite a bit of beneficial information, including this (and I include certain emphasis so that perhaps any who need will get the real gist of what he was meaning):

In YOUR struggle against sin, YOU have not yet resisted to the point of shedding YOUR blood. Yet, have you completely forgotten this word of encouragement that addresses you as SONS? It says,

“My son, do not make light of the JaHVeH's discipline,
and do not lose heart when he rebukes you,
because JaHVeH disciplines the one he loves,
and he chastens everyone he accepts as his son.”

Endure hardship as discipline; God is treating you as his children. For what children are not disciplined by their father? If you are not disciplined—and everyone undergoes discipline—then you are not legitimate, not true sons and daughters at all.

Moreover, we have all had human fathers who disciplined us and we respected them for it. How much more should we submit to the Father of spirits and live! Our human fathers disciplined us for a little while as they thought best; but God disciplines us for our good, in order that we may share in his holiness. No discipline seems pleasant at the time, but painful. Later on, however, it produces a harvest of righteousness and peace for those who have been trained by it.

Therefore, strengthen your feeble arms and weak knees. “Make level paths for your feet,” so that what is lame may not be disabled, but rather healed."


Imagine, now, our dear Lord having the done the things HE did, as a small child. And THEN saying, "Oh, what's the point? I'm not perfect YET, and I might never be - so why should I even bother?? I mean, am I REALLY the Son of GOD??"

Had he done that, who, then, would have given his life for US? WHO... would have been LEFT? But he KNEW who he was, in SPITE of what he still had to go through... including being DISCIPLINED. TRAINED. So as to LEARN obedience. Praise JAH, he apparently learned... FAST. Because we know that, at LEAST by the age of 12, he was on the right track! He learned even sooner than that, though, because of Isaiah's words:

"He will be eating curds and honey when/by the time he knows enough to reject the wrong and choose the right..."

Curds and honey are soft, sweet foods, less than what an older child can eat but more than what a nursing babe can eat.

We, though, can get so caught up in our own personal feelings, worrying about ourselves, looking at our own faces... so that when we DO fail and are disciplined for it... we get angry. Angry at ourselves, really... but WHO do we take it OUT on? Who do we BLAME? Often, we take it out on and blame those we love. Including JAH and Christ. And we let that anger fester... so that we come to HATE those we (once) loved. Including JAH and Christ. Remember Cain? Remember King Saul? Perhaps we go so far as to even question who we are. Or even further... whether JAH or Christ even exist!

We can AVOID this course, though, by listening! And NOT after we've erred, but BEFORE doing so. Listening... to someone who went AHEAD of us and UNDERWENT the "tests"... BEFORE us. And learned, so that he KNOWS. KNOWS what it feels like to err - Psalm 22:6; 38:4; 40:12

And what did he learn... and now passes on to us? Well, for one... there's something to say for pride... and for humility. And one thing we can listen him say is the truth that pride... goes before... a fall. Eye-ee... when we fall, it's usually because of our pride. And vice versa, when pride rules... we will almost assuredly fall. Pride, haughtiness, self-assumingness, thinking more of ourselves than is NECESSARY to think... all of these can lead to a fall. A humiliation. JAH does not WANT that for us, though, and so sent His Son to go through all of that FOR us. So that, in looking at and listening to HIM, we can AVOID all of that. I remember telling my children something when they were small. I overhead my daughter and a friend talking about one "learning from their mistakes." Which is quite true and wise; one SHOULD learn from one's mistakes. BUT... there is a BETTER way, one that is two-fold... and that is, first, to LISTEN to the One sent to lead us. The second, is to learn from OTHER'S mistakes - watch what OTHERS do... consider the outcome of what OTHERS have done.

Adham erred. Cain erred. King Saul erred. Jonah. And how did each of these handle their errors when such were revealed to them? Then we have David. He also erred and greatly so. How, though, did HE handle HIS error when it was revealed to him? Now, looking at all of these, which do YOU think our dear Lord would declare as "righteous, although having sinned? Peter erred repeatedly and once in a manner most of US would say we would NEVER do. Now imagine if David and Peter and went off, kicking rocks so to speak, and saying, "Well, what's the point? Why should I even bother, even continue?"

He also said something about humility, though: that if we don't humble ourselves, we will be humbled. By God. Hence, we can humble ourselves... and listen... and so AVOID discipline (or at least, a lot of it), if we don't want to undergo it... or we can ignore and find ourselves humbled by JAH. Which is done through discipline. Praise Him, though, that such discipline is only because He LOVES us... as His SONS... and so wants us to LEARN righteousness. And through it, yield peaceable fruit.

Blessings from JAH. THAT is what makes (us) rich... and He adds NO pain with it. Discipline is grievous, true, but it does not have to be painful. A willing soldier understands the DIFFICULTY of rising at 3am and the PURPOSE of walking through mud and rain at that early hour: that doing so may one day BENEFIT him, even save his life. And so HE gets up readily, even if sleepily, prepares his pack, puts on his boots... and heads out... looking FORWARD to the journey and ready to give it his all and best. Because anything less could cost him his life. Or... that of his companions. And if he's SMART... he (already) knows that he doesn't know everything, that he is there to LEARN how to survive.

A reluctant soldier, however, or one that believes he knows already how to survive... although having never fought at all, let alone in a thick jungle, will feel that rising at 3am to walk through mud and rain is grievous. Who needs to do THAT?? Let's just go out and get 'em, shoot 'em up. I know what we need to do! And so he will whine and moan and complain, even hate the task. He will not APPRECIATE that the training might one day save his life because he doesn't even see that he NEEDS training. And so, he ridicules the journey... until he finds himself face to face with the enemy... and wishing THEN that he had paid attention. But... too late. Usually.

Time is passing us by, dear one, whether as to the Master's return... or the span of our own physical lives. We simply don't have the time to WASTE on regret. We only need be like David: repent, mourn a bit... then get back up and get back to work. We just don't have time for anything else.

Anyway, you know why I'm sharing all of this, dear brother: love. What else is there? I hope it helps, though, truly. Whomever may need it to.

As always, the greatest of love and peace to you and to your dear household!

YSSFS of Christ,

Shel


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 Post subject: Re: Why not touch him?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2016 3:00 pm 
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It's been a relief to learn that some of us hadn't heard about Christ's childhood here, and thus were shocked by information on this thread. I hadn't. I am still getting my head/heart around it and asking. It's true we should be open to discarding men's teachings and building from new foundations, but still, things can shock.

For years I've pondered our Lord and his young life, his growing up, learning about himself from the scriptures, waiting til 30 years old to hear things ratified by His father's voice at his baptism. I believed that took enormous courage and faith, surrounded by family and friends who may not understand fully.

I will keep asking and I will battle to see/feel/hear/know the truth in all this.

Peace to all,

Loz X

Edit: I had never considered that he had personal 'power' to learn to handle...

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"This is my son. LISTEN to Him!"


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 Post subject: Re: Why not touch him?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2016 5:13 pm 
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Again, my apologies, dear Loz (peace to you, dear sister!). I did think we had discussed this before but in looking for the place on here I see now that I discussed it. No one questioned it, though, so I assumed (wrongly, I now see) that folks knew what I meant. In a thread about the Book of Daniel (by dear LQ - peace, luv!), I shared:

Quote:
For Jehovah's Witnesss, 1914 is blown out of the water without even trying to figure THAT prophesy out, dear one (peace to you!)... along with their whole false teaching about our dear Lord being born "perfect." I mean, if THEIR Bible version is to be believed (and it is, at least as to these matters). Let me show you (from Hebrews 5:7-10):

During his life on earth, Christ offered up supplications and also petitions, with strong outcries and tears, to the One who was able to save him out of death, and he was favorably heard for his godly fear. Although he was a son, he learned obedience from the things he suffered. And after he had been made perfect, he became responsible for everlasting salvation to all those obeying him, because he has been designated by God a high priest in the manner of Mel·chiz′e·dek."

Wait... wha... what? He LEARNED obedience? He didn't already KNOW it? Ummmm... nope. At least, Isaiah wrote that he didn't:

"JAHVEH himself will give you a sign: Look! The young woman (virgin/maiden) will become pregnant and will give birth to a son, and she will name him Im·man′u·El. He will eat butter and honey by the time that he knows how to reject the bad and choose the good. For before the boy knows how to reject the bad and choose the good, the land of the two kings whom you dread will be completely abandoned." Isaiah 7:14-16

Well, lookit that! As a young CHILD... our dear Lord had to LEARN (something)! What? HOW TO CONTROL THAT SPIRIT... along WITH that flesh. We can see that he DIDN'T know how to control them in writings such as Thomas' gospel account. Remember, he was perfect IN SPIRIT... but not in FLESH. And the flesh and the spirit... are ENEMIES. He inherited a perfect spirit from the Father; he inherited his flesh, however, from a woman OF flesh... Mary. Which is why Paul wrote:

"What the Law was incapable of doing because it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and concerning sin, condemned sin in the flesh, so that the righteous requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us who walk, not according to the flesh, but according to the spirit." Romans 8:3, 4

Say, what now? Christ had "sinFUL" flesh? As in flesh... FULL of SIN? Yep! Had to. Else (1)... how could be have been tested LIKE us... in ALL respects? We are sinFUL flesh. How equitable would it have been to put to the test someone whose flesh had NO sin in it? How could it be said that such a one was tested LIKE US, if that were the case? And, numero dos... and this is REALLY important... sinLESS... or PERFECT flesh... DOES NOT DIE. It CAN'T die. Because it does not have SIN... OR DEATH... IN it. t is only flesh with sin (and so death) IN it... the CORRUPTIBLE body... that dies. And our dear Lord, the HOLY One of Israel, JAHESHUA, the Chosen One of JAH (MischaJah)... died... in the flesh.

But, back to 1914...


Somehow, I thought we'd discussed this, either in that thread or another, maybe in a thread about our dear Lord attending school as a child (because I remember folks, particularly dear 'Mom - peace, luv! - saying the same thing as here, how glad they were to know that he HAD been tested, that he had challenges to overcome, too, etc.). I cannot find that thread, though, unfortunately... and...

OH!! I am SO sorry - I just recalled that the discussion including my Lord as a child and Thomas' account was held on another board (JWN)! I recall it because I now recall some of who was involved there (who came here, as well).

I am so sorry - it seemed like only a short time ago, yet it had to be more than 3 years ago, as we will have been here 3 years on the 7th of this month (and we were on the previous xjw site a year or so before that).

I don't know what to say other than I am sorry for thinking most here were aware. I cannot apologize for sharing it, as it is the truth, but I do for not laying a better foundation.

Please forgive me.

And peace to you, all!

YSSFS of Christ,

Shel


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 Post subject: Re: Why not touch him?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2016 7:25 pm 
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Somehow, I thought we'd discussed this, either in that thread or another, maybe in a thread about our dear Lord attending school as a child (because I remember folks, particularly dear 'Mom - peace, luv! - saying the same thing as here, how glad they were to know that he HAD been tested, that he had challenges to overcome, too, etc.). I cannot find that thread, though, unfortunately... and...



Peace everyone,

I remember Shel you mentioning this and I remember being surprised that there were other writings NOT in the Bible canon about our Lords childhood. But I was glad to hear they were written somewhere.
I remember you shared as well in a conversation with me some of the things he did as a child. I personally appreciated knowing this. Of course as a child he would need to learn/listen and obey His father in order to harness this power.
It was more realistic as to challenges he would face and especially being a kid. (maybe a little foolishness in the heart of a boy lol going on).
But although not found in the 66 books, all the verses that we know of about him, "learning obedience" "sinful flesh" " after he was made perfect" etc. explains what he dealt with from his youth up.

Any who, I am grateful once again to know this,
Love, your sister and fellow servant of our Lord Jaheshua, kim


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