xjwsforChrist

Well I am not a expert on these things but my thought on this is there is no use even worrying as to what will become of us if our DNA gets burned. I would think that there must be a way around it if God is all powerful and the source of life.

I mean he never said anywhere that I can see that we must never ever cremate or burn our dead because then they will be dead forever. You think he would have made sure to put up big warning signs through the prophets if it was that way.
It also doesn't seem fair that if someone is disintegrated by fire accidentally or killed by fire by some evil source that they lose out on a chance to live again. I mean if God is love he would not be unfair, especially if the person destroyed by fire was a good person.

I think a lot of it about fire is symbolic and some cultures and people took it literally.

Okay, well, this very well might be the last post I make on this board, depending on how it's received (mornin' and peace to you all!)... 'cause you all might call for my "banning" - LOLOLOL - j/k. But I need to comment... because I am compelled by my Lord to share the truth as to this matter. I TRULY hope NONE are offended, but this is what I am given to share (because I CERTAINLY had to ask!):



There is no use worrying about ANYTHING, dear one (peace to you!): if one can change it then one should change it, so as to no longer HAVE to worry about it. If one can't change it... then one can't change it... and so no USE worrying about it, as worrying won't CHANGE it.



There was: listening... and obeying. If ones didn't DO that, either because of their own desire... or due to being misled by others (remember, there are those whose purpose is to mislead, if possible, EVEN the chosen ones), then how is that on Him? He TOLD Adham/Eve not to eat from the Tree of KOGB; did they listen... and obey? To what result... for themselves AND all of mankind? Look what it has taken for Him to "undo" what they did: the heinous murder of His own Son.

And yet, folks STILL aren't listening to and obeying Him... because they're not listening to and obeying the One He SAID to listen to and obey. Nothing new under the sun, dear one. We keep thinking JAH "owes" US something. He gave us LIFE; WE are the ones who choose what to DO with it... how much value we actually put on it... and whether we will listen to HIM... the One who GAVE it... as to how to KEEP it.



Actually, there are a couple/few scriptures, dear one, that imply it, if not outright state it. You can find those by searching "bury" on, say, http://www.biblegateway.com. Then there is the account where the MOST HOLY One of Israel, JAH of Armies, was actually APPALLED at Israel for burning their children. Because that is what the NATIONS did with theirs! But there are other things:

1. EVERYONE was buried, even their bones being taken by the people so as to be buried in certain places.

2. Whenever there was a destruction, it involved fire.

3. The false pen of the scribes, which falsehoods include ommissions and deletions.

As to this last one, when I asked my Lord about your comment he reminded me that "All things I tell you ARE written"... but not necessarily in the Bible. He explained that it IS written, to avoid the fire for the dead (Israel never burned their dead - only the nations did that - except when they wanted to UTTERLY destroy someone. This utter destruction is why they HAD the burning trash heap outside the city - for the carcasses of dead "unclean" animals; for instance, the wild dogs (hyenas), etc. They WANTED such to be utterly destroyed... and believed that fire accomplished that.)



My understanding is that He DID... but, again, much has been omitted due to the false pen. BUT... he said the current "LAW" that prohibits Jews from burning their dead originated long before the Prophets. Abraham, the father of Israel, certainly knew it and was willing to pay the price to do it:

"Sarah lived to be a hundred and twenty-seven years old. She died at Kiriath Arba (that is, Hebron) in the land of Canaan, and Abraham went to mourn for Sarah and to weep over her. Then Abraham rose from beside his dead wife and spoke to the Hittites. He said, “I am a foreigner and stranger among you. Sell me some property for a burial site here so I can bury my dead.”

"The Hittites replied to Abraham, “Sir, listen to us. You are a mighty prince among us. Bury your dead in the choicest of our tombs. None of us will refuse you his tomb for burying your dead.”

"Then Abraham rose and bowed down before the people of the land, the Hittites. He said to them, “If you are willing to let me bury my dead, then listen to me and intercede with Ephron son of Zohar on my behalf so he will sell me the cave of Machpelah, which belongs to him and is at the end of his field. Ask him to sell it to me for the full price as a burial site among you.”

"Ephron the Hittite was sitting among his people and he replied to Abraham in the hearing of all the Hittites who had come to the gate of his city. “No, my lord,” he said. “Listen to me; I give you the field, and I give you the cave that is in it. I give it to you in the presence of my people. Bury your dead.”

"Again Abraham bowed down before the people of the land and he said to Ephron in their hearing, “Listen to me, if you will. I will pay the price of the field. Accept it from me so I can bury my dead there.”

"Ephron answered Abraham, “Listen to me, my lord; the land is worth four hundred shekels[e] of silver, but what is that between you and me? Bury your dead.”

"Abraham agreed to Ephron’s terms and weighed out for him the price he had named in the hearing of the Hittites: four hundred shekels of silver, according to the weight current among the merchants. So Ephron’s field in Machpelah near Mamre—both the field and the cave in it, and all the trees within the borders of the field—was deeded to Abraham as his property in the presence of all the Hittites who had come to the gate of the city. Afterward Abraham buried his wife Sarah in the cave in the field of Machpelah near Mamre (which is at Hebron) in the land of Canaan. So the field and the cave in it were deeded to Abraham by the Hittites as a burial site."Genesis 23:1-20

This eventually became law among Israel and the Jews, although perhaps not canonized in the Bible (or Torah?):



http://www.chabad.org/library/article_c ... ef6a510874

The above is (from) a very helpful website; however, my understanding that the Jewish REASONS against cremation are inaccurate. It is true that it is a disrespect for JAH Himself... but like much of what I have been able to share with you dear ones lately, a LOT of things were given to Israel in the basis of "holiness" and "sanctity"... because they could not yet grasp the SCIENCE... at it related to the "long garment of skin." Israel was a hard-hearted, hard-headed, stiff-necked people in general and it was only by making "laws" that evoked "mystical" fears that (some) were prevented from doing things that were HARMFUL... to themselves as well as others... immediately... or far into the future! They had problem getting that, though, so imagine JAH trying to explain to them the SCIENTIFIC reasons for things - they were yet a primitive people at the time and so were given what they could "bear."

Had man stuck with JAH, had ISRAEL stuck with JAH... some of what I've shared with you dear ones lately would have been known and understood... MILLENNIA ago! Moses understood it, though. As did those BEFORE him. It wasn't until Israel was ensconced in EGYPT... and taking on some of the culture and ways of THAT nation (which, just so ya'll know... took a lot of ITS culture, ways, and beliefs... from the Hebrews, starting with Joseph's residence among and rulership over them - hence, the "high places"... or altars... that are the pyramids!)... did they FORGET what Joseph and those before HIM knew.



According to Jewish tradition, this is true; HOWEVER, this isn't about what is FAIR/just. There are laws that affect our PHYSICAL bodies that even WE have to respect. No one would have a problem with a SCIENTIST saying, "Oh, ooops, no, once you're cremated all of your DNA is destroyed, so no WAY to bring you back!"... but many WOULD have a problem with GOD saying the same thing! "Uh, wait - you're GOD! What do you MEAN we can just ignore your warning but you won't undo things when we do??"

What is the point, though, in JAH giving a law AGAINST doing something... that can result in one's utter destruction... if it DOESN'T? Wouldn't THAT mean... He lied?? Why not just ignore the warning, then, and EAT from the Tree of KOGB? Okay, so one will die... BUT... JAH, in His love and justice can and will just undo it, so... why NOT eat?



To suggest it being a matter of fairness is to suggest that the warning was because JAH would PUNISH someone for doing it. As some think He punished Adham and Eve; thinking that JAH said, "Do not eat from [TTKOGB] or I will KILL you!" Many TEACH that that is what occurred, but it truly is NOT. He tried to WARN them as to what would occur IF THEY DID. They died, NOT because He killed them... but because they disobeyed His WARNING... and ATE.

Same thing here: JAH is not unrighteous so as to PUNISH someone for ignorantly disobeying. But is it truly HIS responsibility to undo the effects and results of something He has WARNED us would occur so we should not DO it??

That is HUGE reason for the "gap" between man and God: our demand for "fairness." Where, though, it is written that life is FAIR? It is NOT. Not THIS one. If it WERE... NOTHING AND NO ONE WOULD DIE... except that it/they literally committed a sin. DID something. And not die simply because the "garment of skin" has sin... and so DEATH... IN it. But that IS why we die, why animals/beasts die: NOT because WE sin... but because our bodies have sin (and so death) IN them. They can't help BUT die.

And what is that "sin"? It is the LACK... of LIFE. NO life in them. Until Christ... THE Life... came! Because BEFORE that, man was "cut off"... from Christ, the Tree OF Life. He, the True Vine, Root of Jesse, Sprout. Since HIM, man has a "Way"... to "come"... TO Life!

I'm sorry - I'm not trying to scare anyone, etc. But perhaps if we stop thinking in terms of what is "fair" as to US... MAN... and start thinking along the lines that, well, JAH IS the Almighty God, the MOST HOLY... and so WHATEVER He deems is "just" (including that folks may NOT receive life if their bodies are burned BECAUSE of the science involved... and that the error, while unfortunate and perhaps not the choosing of the invididual themselves, IS a serious error, hence, His warnings against it)... IS just... and stop blaming HIM... for OUR errors... PERHAPS we can show Him that we truly DO love Him. Because our desire is for HIS will to be done... and not our sense of "fairness" to be appeased.

Again, I do not mean to offend. But we are a species so much more concerned with our own "rights" and what WE view as "fair", that we often totally overlook that it's not really upon US to decide that; that it really is upon JAH Himself.

BUT, to respond, dear tec (peace to you!) did share with us HOW JAH MIGHT resolve this problem: baby teeth. Surely, if there was a WAY to preserve those who WERE burned involuntarily or unknowingly, He would know of it... and have already made provision for it. So, again, nothing to worry ABOUT.



Perhaps, dear one, perhaps. I think, though, that if we let our own sense of "fairness" override what is TRUE, we will lose out even further. Because rather than going from THIS point on... and letting JAH and Christ "worry" about those behind us (and find/preserve some part of them that was NOT burned)... we will deem ourselves "rightly hot with anger"... and leave off seeking Him altogether. As some often say, "Well, if He's like this or that... or does this or that... or says this or that... then I don't want no part of Him."

He is not looking for those who want Him to be as THEY wish Him to be... but will accept Him... as He truly is.

WE don't know what amount... or kind... of energy it took to create the physical universe... or man. Or what kind... or amount... it takes to destroy it. We CAN, though, simply exercise faith that, since God IS love... love... WILL prevail. Whether that comports with our own personal paradigms/views of love... or not. That WE might be wrong... but He isn't.

Again, some of ya'll might call for me to cease after this... and I understand that - and it's okay. I understand how some of things ARE hard to receive/hear. I have shared with you before how sometimes even I go, "You want me to tell them/say WHAT, Lord?!"... particularly when I know it is going to impinge on some's consciences or sense of reality. I totally get that... and so it's not ALWAYS easy for me to share. I am sure you can understand that.

Alternatively, some might say, "Well, if that is or COULD be true, then I don't want any parts of God." But the truth is, that won't really actually make a difference. We can choose not to serve/follow/have faith/believe in God, yes... but our doing so doesn't eliminate Him... or the results of HIS will. It just eliminates our faith in Him. Nothing more.

Information is good. Truthful information is better... but not always easy to receive, I know.

But I do hope this helps, truly.

Again, I bid you ALL peace!

Your servant and a slave of Christ,

Shellama

Yes.


Peace,
tammy

Yeah, I prolly should'a put that comment first, eh, dear tec? LOLOLOLOL!

Peace to you, girlie, and thanks for highlighting that!

YSSFS of Christ,

Shellama, a bit embarassed about her 20/20 hindsight...

I hear everything Shelby!

Thank you for sharing this truth with all of us.

Jah has always been clear to his people as to instructions that will benefit them THEN and in the FUTURE!

Burial verses cremation was clear and a given... to those that heeded Jahs voice.

He made it clear that " burning ( passing through the fire) the dead was something that NEVER came up into his heart."

But despite this, many did it anyways. And because of Israel's hard- hearted ness, they took on and adopted a lot of the ways of the nations that did not respect life in the same way as Jah did and taught his people. The most accurate examples that we can look to is those that belonged to Jah and see how they treated their dead. This truth gave me a whole different understanding in the last few years.

My spirit bears witness with this understanding.

Thank you and love to you all
Justmom

Oh no, I didn't think anything like that at all : )

I hear you on the science aspect of how if something cannot be done it cannot be done... and also that if there WAS a way (other than the Way that we have already been given and the one provision that was shared with me), then God does KNOW it and can provide it. Like you have said, He already knows, and Has already seen, what we have yet to see and live through.

Peace,
tammy

That is exactly what I meant to share, along with how we need to try and STOP blaming JAH for what we don't (yet) understand. I personally am overjoyed... at the science I have recently come to understand (and shared) in connection with Him and His "laws." WE don't always understand the good of what we think is bad... or the bad of what we think is good. We keep trying to understand Him in relation to ourselves... when we CAN'T DO THAT.

We do it because we believe we are made in His image. We are NOT; we are made in ADHAM'S image... AFTER he sinned. And so trying to understand what we are NOW... in comparison to JAH... or worse, Him in comparison to US... won't work. CAN'T work. We can ONLY understand Him by means of the One who IS His image: Christ. That One, by becoming flesh... "BRIDGED THE GAP"... between what is SPIRIT and what is FLESH.

And so, it is ONLY through him, Christ, that WE can see/know/understand JAH... and HIS will and works... and that JAH "knows" US, as the flesh we are! There is NO OTHER WAY.

Hence, if we look at/to... and listen to that One, the HOLY ONE of Israel, not just to know JAH... but know what He did, said, why... and how it benefits/has consequences for US... we will see SO much... SO much... even beyond our physical world. We will see WHY the Law... and its related tabernacle/temple/priesthood arrangement... WAS. And WHAT it was!

If, though, we keep leaning our own understanding, keep trying to make sense of God in relation to OUR own (very limited, yet) understanding of the physical... we only extend the time it takes for us to know and understand the TRUTH: WHO we are... WHY we are here... HOW we got here... WHAT we are made of... what we WILL be made of... etc.

Just as it is with any child that wants to do it all himself/herself, rather than listen to a LOVING parent try to assist and explain, though... some choose to ignore... and so have to learn the "hard" way. Which also often takes much longer.

And for those who might say, "Well, He didn't explain to ME!" keep in mind that even today we have parents that make decisions that affect their children. For instance, parents who keep their children from their grandparents. Happens all the time. And man (Adham) AND Israel did that... made decisions... NOT just for themselves... but for their children... and their childrens' children... and their childrens' childrens' children... on down until today. And just like a grandparent in such situation today decides the BEST thing is to wait for the CHILD to make the decision to have a relationship... rather than dragging EVERYONE through a bad scene, as well as risking jeopardizing the relationship the child has with its parent(s)... so too, the MOST HOLY One of Israel, JAH of Armies, waits on US to make the decision to have one with Him. Rather than dragging us... and our parents... through turmoil. He would rather WE come to know that our parents may have (inadvertently misled us, made wrong decisions for us)... than tell us Himself. Because... who would we believe? Our parents... or grandparents? If we are very small children, it would most likely be our parents, with us resenting our grandparents for bad-mouthing them, yes? And so we are left to CHOOSE!

And if/when we DO choose a relationship with JAH... His arms are wide open. Only one caveat: one must enter those arms... through the Door that is His Son, the HOLY ONE of Israel and Holy Spirit, JAHESHUA, His Chosen One (MischaJah).

As always, I hope this helps... and bid you all peace!

YSSFS of Christ,

Shellama

I hear everything you just shared. All of it!



I have seen how this is true. We think something is bad... and some then try to justify something bad (like thinking/writing that God struck Uzzah down for trying to prevent the arc from falling... rather than understanding that the warning not to touch the ark was to protect people from natural consequences). Then, when something SEEMS to be God doing something unloving or bad, some will try to convince others that the unloving thing is actually loving. People will do that to justify an eternal torment in hell, also.

Rather than assign bad motives to God and then try to justify them, thereby turning people away who know that it is wrong and so refuse to follow something they know does not come from love... we need only look to Christ and ask Him to know Truth. It is better to say that we don't know when we don't know, and instead point to Christ as the means TO know (if Christ did not do that, then God does not do that) than to try and make up a reason why something bad is actually good.





Yes, and yes.

We also have our Lord saying to Israel:

"How I have longed to gather your children as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings... but YOU were not willing."

Peace,
tammy

Adding to that, this actually ties into Paul's young atheist thread. People... and especially youths... can see inconsistencies. My son could, and would come to me with questions about how something was unloving, or why did this happen in the bible, etc, etc.

Kids are smart. Give them an answer that doesn't make sense with other things that you have told them or that are written... and they will spot it. They might tuck it down and not say anything, and they might even learn to ignore it, but they spotted it.

Peace,
tammy

I have to add that my spirit does not bear witness to this

That is all

_________________
To fear me is to love me....

LOL, ok then there it is then, an answer to my post. I am no expert and whatever will be will be. You make a lot of sense Shelby and I decided years ago I do not choose cremation for me.
I was not questioning God or saying he was unfair or owed us anything, I was speculating that he is always fair.

My husband died 11 years ago next month, he had insisted he wanted to be cremated if he died, so i had him cremated it didn't feel right though. I had my Mom cremated cause it was the instructions in her will, now I guess I won't ever see them again

Don't be too sure of that

_________________
To fear me is to love me....

Honestly, if God is GOD, do you think He would have any trouble bringing back anyone?

I was Trying to say that Paul, but I guess sounded like I was doubting it.

But don't take my word for it

http://youtu.be/KBaUcYqKoTs

_________________
To fear me is to love me....